The Bitcoin mining industry is going through a real shift, and Fred Thiel is right in the middle of it. Fred is the Chairman and CEO of MARA — one of the largest publicly traded Bitcoin miners in the world — and I sat down with him for a wide-ranging conversation about where mining is heading, how AI is changing everything, and MARA’s roadmap for the years to come.
He also shared some genuinely surprising takes on Bitcoin’s role in the global financial system. Here’s a preview.
How MARA became a four-gigawatt energy company
MARA now controls about four gigawatts of power capacity. That’s enough electricity to power millions of homes — and it puts MARA in a very unique position as AI capital reshapes the energy landscape.
Fred walked me through the picture. AI companies are racing to build data centers, and demand for power has completely blown past supply. It takes 6 to 7 years to build a new plant, and hyperscalers like Google can’t wait that long. That means anyone sitting on ready-to-go power and land right now — including Bitcoin miners — is in what Fred calls “a golden position.”
Fred also broke down the economics in a way I found eye-opening. A Bitcoin mining site costs about $1 million per megawatt to build. A data center site — just the infrastructure, before adding any compute — runs $10 to $15 million per megawatt. Once you factor in the GPUs, a single data center can easily cost hundreds of millions.
MARA’s strategy is to partner rather than go it alone. Their deal with Starwood Digital Ventures gives them the design expertise, hyperscaler relationships, and construction capacity you need to build data centers at scale. In the meantime, MARA can keep mining Bitcoin on their sites until AI tenants are ready to move in — a two-year process at minimum. And because their mining rigs are containerized, they can physically move them from site to site as capacity comes online.
Fred was also honest about the timing. When I asked if he wished MARA had pivoted to AI sooner, he acknowledged it in hindsight — but said they deliberately waited because they didn’t have the internal expertise to compete on data center design and construction. Waiting for the right partner mattered more than being first.
MARA sold 20,000 Bitcoin — Fred’s reasoning
Yes, MARA also sold 20,000 Bitcoin from its balance sheet — and honestly, at this point, corporate Bitcoin sales aren’t the shocking headlines they used to be. Plenty of companies are actively managing their treasuries this year, and MARA is one of them.
Fred laid out the reasoning. The sale allowed MARA to retire about $1 billion in convertible debt at a discount, effectively locking in an equivalent price of $80,000 per coin. As the CEO of a publicly traded company, Fred said his job is to make decisions that serve shareholders — which sometimes means paying down expensive debt and freeing up capital for other investments.
Whether you agree with the move or not, it’s worth hearing him make the case himself.
Where he sees Bitcoin going next
Some of the most interesting parts of the conversation were toward the end of the show. Fred believes strongly in Bitcoin as a long-term store of value and inflation hedge. But he also had some pretty candid views on Bitcoin’s role as everyday money that surprised me.
His take is that Bitcoin isn’t likely to become the dominant medium for daily transactions — instead, he expects stablecoins to handle most of that volume, especially in AI-driven commerce. He also pointed to declining transaction fees and shrinking block rewards as real headwinds for miners.
Whether you agree or not, hearing it from someone running one of the largest mining operations in the world is worth your time.
Stream the show wherever you listen to podcasts.
NEW: Signed copies of Bitcoin Is For Everyone
One last thing I’m excited to share. I’ve been getting so many messages from people asking if there’s a way to buy a copy of my book, Bitcoin Is For Everyone, using sats — and now there is.
You can grab a limited number of signed copies from my new shop at shop.talkingbitcoin.com, powered by Speed Wallet. The whole point of the book is to make Bitcoin approachable for anyone, so being able to actually pay for it in Bitcoin closes the loop!
Supply is genuinely limited, so if you’ve been thinking about grabbing one for yourself or someone you’re trying to orange pill, this is the moment.
📦 Order your signed copy: shop.talkingbitcoin.com
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— Natalie
Disclaimer: This newsletter is for informational and entertainment purposes only and should not be considered financial, investment, or legal advice. I am not a financial advisor. Always do your own research before making any investment decisions. Information and opinions shared here may change without notice. Some links in this newsletter are affiliate or sponsor links, which means I may earn a commission at no additional cost to you.
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