Brand isn't what you say it is. It's what your customers say it is.

Branding is not marketing. Marketing is not advertising. And authenticity is not a mission statement on a website. Laurel Mintz makes these distinctions clearly and quickly — and then gets into the practical mechanics of building brands that actually resonate.

In this episode, Shelley and Graham speak with Laurel, CEO and Founder of award-winning LA-based marketing agency Elevate My Brand. She’s also a podcast host, board member, mentor, and someone who has seen how easily brands lose sight of their customers in the pursuit of their own ideas.

Her word vomit exercise — listing everything you want your brand to be associated with, followed by everything you definitely don’t want it to be — is a useful starting point for any team trying to find clarity. So is her point about the customer feedback loop: using a survey not just for insight, but as a sell-through opportunity by attaching a small discount to completion.

The most important thing she says, though, is about myopia. Brands that focus only on their own narrative, without tracking what their competitors are doing and what their customers actually believe about them, are building on sand. The data, she argues, should constantly be testing whether who you think you are matches who your customers think you are.

Worth 17 minutes if you work in brand, marketing, or customer experience.