A guest episode from The Audiences Podcast, as Dorothy and AX join Francesco D'Orazio and Sal Morton to talk about how magic is increasingly where audiences go to find meaning beyond the algorithm.
This is Five and Nine, a podcast and newsletter at the crossroads of magic, work and economic justice. This is a guest episode in Season 5.
You can find Five and Nine on Apple, Spotify, Google, Instagram and at thisisfiveandnine.com.
Who’s the Audience of Magic? How has it evolved over the past few years? Where is it going next? 🪄
From TikTok tarot readings to “manifesting crypto gains”, we explore how audiences are engaging with magic to reassert individual agency, reinterpret identity, and regain some level of control over systems trying to define them.
In this episode, Five and Nine’s Mina AX and Dorothy R. Santos, PhD, have a magical conversation with The Audiences Podcast, hosted by Francesco D’Orazio and produced by Sal Morton.
They dissect AI-generated audience personas to ask what happens when machine learning tries to map belief. Throughout, they reflect on the rise of mystical frameworks not as escape, but as resistance: a response to overexposure, over-simulation, and a growing desire to feel agency again. Whether it’s tarot as feedback loop, divination as dialogue, or witchcraft as subculture, magic is increasingly where audiences go to find meaning beyond the algorithm.
About The Audiences Podcast
The Audiences Podcast is the audience discovery show. We talk to guests who build audiences for a living. And as we discuss what it takes to build an audience, we explore new emerging audiences in fashion, tech, media and many other industries. Subscribe to never miss an episode. Subscribe to never miss an episode.
Five and Nine is pleased to host a column by Selene Darkheart, aka Season 3 guest Victoria Ku, a money and kitchen witch taking us on creative journey through strategic spellcraft and other powerful artistic enchantments to make life magical and full of wealth.
As the weather gets colder, the instinct to cozy beneath blankets, light a fire, and manifest our future harvest, gets stronger. Lean in, children of the Universe! Today we’re going to power up that energy by doing a little candle dressing and anointment. This is a great energy-directing ritual (spell) for anyone who wants to tap into their inner magic and get the ball rolling for future blessings.
Ingredients:
Candle
Slip of paper or Bay leaf to write intentions on
Olive oil
Cinnamon
Salt
Cauldron/bowl
Half a lemon
Start by preparing your work space and cleansing any lingering energy or distractive thoughts. You can light a white candle, burn sage, or meditate with a crystal in hand.
The Magic:
Pour enough salt into your cauldron for the lemon to be able to sit stably. Salt is a purifier so it will clear away any hidden energies when you’re casting your blessing.
Place half of the lemon in the center of the salt. Lemon brings in clean, uplifting energy.
Using your fingers, spread olive oil from tip to base of the candle. This direction signifies bringing blessings and energy TO you, thus anointing your candle.
Sprinkle cinnamon, which brings great things like joy, health or fortune, onto the oiled candle so that it sticks to the surface; thus dressing your candle.
Stick the candle into the center of the lemon and light it up.
Write your intentions onto a bay leaf or piece of paper.
Burn your bay leaf or paper, imagining your intention already manifesting in this world and shooting towards you.
If you have ashes, you can sprinkle them outside of your front door and let the wind carry them into the world.
Let the candle fully burn down to the lemon.
Happy Holidays, cosmic beings. May you take your inner power and watch it fulfill your wishes.
Until the next moon!
Selene Darkheart (Priestess of Pentacles, Enchantress of Innovation, Directrix of Creative Arts) by night, Victoria K by day. As a seasoned money and (surprising) kitchen witch, I blend magic with modern strategies to conjure up a life of abundance. I’ve lived many lives as a corporate financial analyst for Wells Fargo, builder and maker of sculptures and digital products, and scaler of global payment systems for Airbnb. Let’s go on a creative journey together through strategic spellcraft, and other powerful artistic enchantments to make life magical and full of wealth.
Remember that this content is for informational and entertainment purposes only, and should NOT be considered financial advice. Always consult a qualified professional before making any financial decisions that could impact your financial profile.
Check out our new Zener Cards in “Algorithms and the Occult”, a new edition of ASAP/Review, one of the scholarly publications of the Association for the Study of the Arts of the Present, curated by Tamara Kneese, Jeffrey Moro & Briana Vecchione:
These remixed Zener cards feature classic Rider-Waite tarot iconography. In the Rider-Waite deck, the five elements reflect a sense of equilibrium: living beings rely on a balance of the different elements to survive. On the worldly plane, they also represent different aspects: water for emotions, earth for material goods (like money), fire for creativity, air for rationality, and wood for structure and hierarchy.
Ready to think about the future in unexpected ways? Five and Nine Futures Lab does workshops, leadership coaching, and strategic planning for organizations and entrepreneurs seeking to expand their creative thinking processes.
Check out our new website to learn more about ways we can work together.
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Subscribe now for just $6 per month and get access to our paid programming. This podcast is always free, but paid subscribers will get access to special content, like discounts on our classes, free listens of our standalone meditations, and a monthly tarotscope we produce in partnership with Ignota Books.
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Five and Nine is a podcast and newsletter at the crossroads of magic, work and economic justice. We publish “moonthly” — on new moons 🌚 and full moons 🌝 — , and we provide an ongoing critical discussion through readings, reflections and debate.
Five and Nine is produced by Five and Nine Futures Lab, a research, design and strategy consultancy that helps organizations and companies build better futures through the lens of work, care and magic.
In this new world, we’re all rethinking the meaning of work and justice in our lives. Our lives and livelihoods are more essential than ever in identifying ways forward for society that can be grounded in care, compassion and sustainability.
Directors of Magic. Dorothy R. Santos and Xiaowei R. Wang
Creative Director. Xiaowei R. Wang
Lead Producer. Mina AX
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